Go home english boy

I want to know why YOU (english men) laugh against bill 101 in quebec and why you find we are stupid to try to protect french language. We are the only place in america who speak french and we try to keep it.

[TV_Guy]

Please expand on the bill. How will they ban a language? They better not, it's about the only place I want to visit out of all the Americas.

[ogb]

I'm not English, but it is the same that we had in the French vocabulary topic: you can't artificially keep a language alive by writing it in a bill. Either the people think the same way and all speak French, or the language is lost, no matter how many laws you create.

[MacReady]

Interesting, I think it has to do with language level. I think English language is one of hardest language to learn to write. They call English language level 4 or 5 same as Arabic, Chinese or Japanese, maybe Russian too. French language is level 2 or 3, I think that why they struggle to write a bill for laws.

[This message has been edited by MacReady (edited January 13, 2002).]

I want to reply to MacReady, English is very easy if you compare it to french. You don't have to memorise a thousand of language rules. You dont have any gender like female or male noun you use "a" and "an" like : "a red apple" in french is "une pomme rouge"
you have just three tense of verb (past present futur)in french they have too many tense. Why you think the world use english for better communication cuz it a simple language and it easy for everyone to learn it.

And for now my reply is for TV_Guy
The bill 101 is not banding a language. He just try to protect the french you can put english on your store banner but you have to put french in bigger caps. But everywhere in Quebec you can pass an order for a pizza or somethings else in english and you will receive want you want. Quebec is not a billingual province like New-Brunswick. In Quebec we use english cuz we are good for english people but if you go in Ontario dont put an order in french or you will kick out of the store.

[ogb]

Originally posted by MacReady:
I think English language is one of hardest language to learn to write.

Definitely the opposite is the case. There is probably no easier language than English - that's one of the main reasons why it became world language.

[Phreakmeister]

OGB:
The reason English became the most important language of the world, is the British Empire. Back in the old days, one third of the world was under British control. So it was vital to be able to speak English.

Before English, German was the most important language (early 20th century). This because Germany by then covered almost all of Europe. It stretched from the borders with the Netherlands into modern day Russia and Estonia.
Before German, French was the main language. This also because of Napoleon, who conquered almost all of Europe.
And before French, Latin was the main language. This because all of Europe, northern Africa, the Middle East, and parts of the Arabian peninsula fell under Roman control.

[ogb]

Originally posted by Phreakmeister:
OGB:
The reason English became the most important language of the world, is the British Empire. Back in the old days, one third of the world was under British control. So it was vital to be able to speak English.


Yes, this is another main reason for spreading the English language over the globe. But this isn't the main reason why almost everybody all over the world meanwhile learns English at school. If you'd think of making a language no.1 that is spoken by most people, then everybody had to learn Chinese - assume that this will never happen (at least I am going to refuse http://www.dumblaws.com/ubb/wink.gif). In the former communist countries they all were forced to learn Russian to make it a world language, but the people from the GDR today don't remember more than just single words because it was too complicated and they didn't want to learn it (my sister in law is an example for that).

[thud]

I'm with Dieu - cool name by the way. I'm answering to God!!!

In response to Dieu.
Just for the record, English does have more than three tenses, its just that its formulated differently. Future perfect, pluperfect, conditional etc do exist, its just that English combines existing words to form many tenses (eg "will have had" "would be eating" "had been writing") rather than create new endings on words.
Not really important in this discussion, I just thought it ought to be pointed out.

[Sephirstein]

Wow Dieu...Votre anglais est aussi bon que celui de Pierre Trudeau quand il avait cinq ans... http://www.dumblaws.com/ubb/smile.gif...J'habite à Cornwall, Ontario, et ici, c'est très facile d'être servir en français si on en veut. Dans un pays dans lequel la majorité de la population est anglophone, ce n'est pas logique de dire que la langue française est en dangé quand le premier ministre du pays (Jean Chrétien) est un francophone qui a de la difficulté de communiquer en anglais.

[Serendipity]

Salut les copains! Moi, je suis anglais mais un peu francophone http://www.dumblaws.com/ubb/smile.gif Dieu, si je peux réponder a (pardon, je n'ai pas d'accent grave http://www.dumblaws.com/ubb/frown.gif) votre question, moi, je ne ris pas, je ne me moque pas a vous qui ne voulent que parler dans l'une des plus belles langues. Et donc, quand on me dit "go home english boy", je ne comprends pas http://www.dumblaws.com/ubb/confused.gif Qu'est-ce que l'origine de votre grief?

(I hope that makes sense!! http://www.dumblaws.com/ubb/smile.gif)

------------------
Beware The Wrath of Mod!
Mod Squad Poster (http://www.angelfire.com/hi5/serendipity/MSPoster/ModSquad.html)

I think another modern day influencing factor is music. Most pop music is in English. I realise individual countries have their own stars but 99% of the international stars sing in English - I've never seen an Estonian singer in the UK charts (good luck though if you're out there). The only French I know is (forgive the spelling) 'Joue le Taxi' by Vanessa Paradise.

If The Beatles had sung in Welsh the world would be a different place.

Each empire spoke the language of its controlling power, which is why latin continued to be used throughout what was once controlled by Rome, english is spoken everywhere which was conquered by Britain (including Australia and much of Africa & North America), spanish is sponken in places which made up the spanish empire (mainly central & south America) etc.

To try to force a language on a people because of a bygone age is racism, and as such, is contrary to international laws on human rights.


Originally posted by ogb:
Yes, this is another main reason for spreading the English language over the globe. But this isn't the main reason why almost everybody all over the world meanwhile learns English at school. If you'd think of making a language no.1 that is spoken by most people, then everybody had to learn Chinese - assume that this will never happen (at least I am going to refuse http://www.dumblaws.com/ubb/wink.gif). In the former communist countries they all were forced to learn Russian to make it a world language, but the people from the GDR today don't remember more than just single words because it was too complicated and they didn't want to learn it (my sister in law is an example for that).

[jettmotto]

Originally posted by Serendipity
Salut les copains! Moi, je suis anglais mais un peu francophone http://www.dumblaws.com/ubb/smile.gif Dieu, si je peux réponder a (pardon, je n'ai pas d'accent grave http://www.dumblaws.com/ubb/frown.gif) votre question, moi, je ne ris pas, je ne me moque pas a vous qui ne voulent que parler dans l'une des plus belles langues. Et donc, quand on me dit "go home english boy", je ne comprends pas http://www.dumblaws.com/ubb/confused.gif Qu'est-ce que l'origine de votre grief?

(I hope that makes sense!! http://www.dumblaws.com/ubb/smile.gif)


------------------
Beware The Wrath of Mod!
Mod Squad Poster (http://www.angelfire.com/hi5/serendipity/MSPoster/ModSquad.html)
:( what! :(

[TheSecretKnight]

Originally posted by Dieu
I want to reply to MacReady, English is very easy if you compare it to french. You don't have to memorise a thousand of language rules. You dont have any gender like female or male noun you use "a" and "an" like : "a red apple" in french is "une pomme rouge"
you have just three tense of verb (past present futur)in french they have too many tense. Why you think the world use english for better communication cuz it a simple language and it easy for everyone to learn it.

1.) It's easier to remember a tousand rules than several thousands exceptions to rules.

2.) It'd be hard for you to say English is easy; your English seems rather poor.

3.) There are more than three tenses of verbs, including past preticate, past inperfect, past progressive, present, present progressive, future, future progessive, etc.

4.) English is a world language because of the media(music, etc), America's influence on the world, etc, not because English is an easy language.

Quello é tutto.

~§ecretKnight

While Dieu's intervention was awkward, the root of his message remains true - at least to me : bill 101 is certainly not "dumb"; but then again, this whole website is politically incorrect.

Do not be fooled : bill 101 is not portrayed as the one and only way to protect our French heritage. It is a simple tool. The survival of our culture is up to the inhabitants themselves. And while the average inhabitant tends to lower the quality of French rather than augment it, it is still well-preserved among the literate population. More so, in my opinion, than it is in France (exemplarily, you often can not be understood in restaurants unless you order your meal in English; also, many French words are being replaced by English words, without leaving any alternative : such is the case of "week-end", which has no French alternative in France.)

There are several reasons as to why English has become the global world language, and its ease of use is undoubtedly one of them (as far as I know, you all were easily able to understand Dieu, despite the "poorness" of his English.) I learned it by reading and writing on the Internet since I was 14; I am now 19 and I can humbly admit that I am capable of expressing myself rather proficiently. And French does have much more exceptions than rules.

I assume that most of this forum's residents belong to the U.S. culture. If so, please do not judge us French Quebecers so harshly. Your culture is full of life and depth, while ours is constantly menaced. You can not understand how terrifying it is to realize that your descendants might give up on their culture and become assimilated.

By the way, I must send my best regards to the French Canadians who live outside of Québec. They are often forgotten, and they should not be. Keep fighting for your rights.

[Jeff]

Interesting, I think it has to do with language level. I think English language is one of hardest language to learn to write. They call English language level 4 or 5 same as Arabic, Chinese or Japanese, maybe Russian too. French language is level 2 or 3, I think that why they struggle to write a bill for laws.

They call English language level 4 or 5... Who is "they"?

[@gen]

Originally posted by Fruit & Veg
I think another modern day influencing factor is music. Most pop music is in English. I realise individual countries have their own stars but 99% of the international stars sing in English - I've never seen an Estonian singer in the UK charts (good luck though if you're out there). The only French I know is (forgive the spelling) 'Joue le Taxi' by Vanessa Paradise.

If The Beatles had sung in Welsh the world would be a different place.

Don´t forget TV and movies.

D@mm... I forget that most other countrys heva their programs spoken over.

[weldordave]

I'll bet that every language knows what "Daisey-Cutter" means!!:p

[Madscot]

Next to Japanese, english is THE HARDEST language to learn. The male and femal stuff seems hard but most other languages have it. I only soeak english and its NOT the world language. More people speak mandarin chinese than anything else. You americans think that because you speak it and because you think you are more important than everyone else.

[Sjax]

Madscot: English is NOT at any standard the hardest, secondhardest or thirdhardest language to learn. It is one of the easiest.
I speak english, german, danish, and a little bit french and english is by far the easiest of these languages.

[Phreakmeister]

I totally agree with you, Sjax. I speak German, French, English, Dutch, Italian and a bit of Spanish, and I find English (after Dutch ofcourse) the easiest language of all.

Basque is generally seen as the most difficult language in the world, as it bears no relationship to any kind of language in the world whatsoever.

[Sjax]

My God Phreak. You are a walking dictionary.
I have heard that theres about 4000 different languages in the world, and about 2000 of them are spoken in New Zealand alone.

[Phreakmeister]

Originally posted by Sjax
I have heard that theres about 4000 different languages in the world, and about 2000 of them are spoken in New Zealand alone.

According to Ethnologue (http://www.ethnologue.com/language_index.asp), there are 6,800 main languages and 41,000 alternate names and dialects.
New Zealand actually has only 4 'native' languages: English, Maori, Pitcairn-Norfolk and the New Zealand sign language.

The number of languages listed for Papua New Guinea is 832. Of those, 823 are living languages and 9 are extinct.
The number of languages listed for Indonesia is 731. Of those, 726 are living languages, 2 are second languages without mother tongue speakers, and 3 are extinct.
The number of languages listed for Nigeria is 515. Of those, 505 are living languages, 2 are second languages without mother tongue speakers, and 8 are extinct.
The number of languages listed for India is 398. Of those, 387 are living languages and 11 are extinct.
The number of languages listed for Mexico is 295. Of those, 288 are living languages and 7 are extinct.
The number of languages listed for Cameroon is 286. Of those, 279 are living languages, 3 are second languages without mother tongue speakers, and 4 are extinct.
The number of languages listed for Australia is 268. Of those, 235 are living languages, 2 are second languages without mother tongue speakers, and 31 are extinct.
The number of languages listed for Brazil is 234. Of those, 192 are living languages and 42 are extinct.
The number of languages listed for the USA is 231. Of those, 176 are living languages, 3 are second languages without mother tongue speakers, and 52 are extinct.
The number of languages listed for the Democratic Republic of Congo is 219. Of those, 218 are living languages and 1 is extinct.
The number of languages listed for China is 202. Of those, 201 are living languages and 1 is extinct.
The number of languages listed for Philippines is 172. Of those, 169 are living languages and 3 are extinct.
The number of languages listed for Tanzania is 137. Of those, 135 are living languages and 2 are extinct.
The number of languages listed for Vanuatu is 110. Of those, 109 are living languages and 1 is extinct.
The number of languages listed for Peru is 106. Of those, 92 are living languages and 14 are extinct.
The number of languages listed for Russia is 103. Of those, 100 are living languages and 3 are extinct.
The number of languages listed for Colombia is 98. Of those, 78 are living languages and 20 are extinct.
The number of languages listed for Viet Nam is 94. Of those, 93 are living languages and 1 is extinct.
The number of languages listed for Canada is 90. Of those, 85 are living languages and 5 are extinct.
The number of languages listed for Ethiopia is 86. Of those, 82 are living languages and 4 are extinct.

[Phreakmeister]

Originally posted by Madscot
More people speak mandarin chinese than anything else.

The 10 Most Spoken Languages of the World
(Language / Approximate number of speakers)
1. Chinese (Mandarin) - 1,075,000,000
2. English - 514,000,000
3. Hindustani - 496,000,000
4. Spanish - 425,000,000
5. Russian - 275,000,000
6. Arabic - 256,000,000
7. Bengali - 215,000,000
8. Portuguese - 194,000,000
9. Malay-Indonesian - 176,000,000
10. French - 129,000,000
(according to Ethnologue)

The 20 Most Spoken Languages of the World
1. Mandarin - 900,000,000
2. English - 430,000,000
3. Hindi - 320,000,000
4. Spanish - 310,000,000
5. Russian - 280,000,000
6. Arabic - 185,000,000
7. Bengali - 180,000,000
8. Portuguese - 175,000,000
9. Malay / Indonesian - 140,000,000
10. Japanese - 125,000,000
11. German - 120,000,000
12. French - 115,000,000
13. Urdu - 88,000,000
14. Punjabi - 75,000,000
15. Korean - 68,000,000
16. Telugu - 64,000,000
17. Italian - 63,000,000
18. Tamil - 62,000,000
19. Marathi - 61,000,000
20. Cantonese - 60,000,000
(according to Kryss Katsiavriades)

The 50 Most Widely Spoken Languages of the World
1. Mandarin - 885,000,000
2. Spanish - 332,000,000
3. English - 322,000,000
4. Bengali - 189,000,000
5. Hindi - 182,000,000
6. Portuguese - 170,000,000
7. Russian - 170,000,000
8. Japanese - 125,000,000
9. German - 98,000,000
10. Wu - 77,200,000
11. Javanese - 75,500,000
12. Korean - 75,000,000
13. French - 72,000,000
14. Vietnamese - 67,700,000
15. Telugu - 66,400,000
16. Cantonese (Yue) - 66,000,000
17. Marathi - 64,800,000
18. Tamil - 63,100,000
19. Turkish - 59,000,000
20. Urdu - 58,000,000
21. Min Nan (Fukienese) - 49,000,000
22. Jinyu - 45,000,000
23. Gujarati - 44,000,000
24. Polish - 44,000,000
25. Egyptian spoken Arabic - 42,500,000
26. Ukrainian - 41,000,000
27. Italian - 37,000,000
28. Hunan (Xiang) - 36,000,000
29. Malayalam - 34,000,000
30. Hakka - 34,000,000
31. Kannada - 33,700,000
32. Oriya - 31,000,000
33. Panjabi - 30,000,000
34. Sunda - 27,000,000
35. Panjabi - 26,000,000
36. Romanian - 26.0
37. Bhojpuri - 25,000,000
38. Azerbaijani - 24,400,000
39. Farsi - 24,300,000
40. Maithili - 24,300,000
41. Hausa - 24,200,000
42. Algerian spoken Arabic - 22,400,000
43. Burmese - 22,000,000
44. Serbo-Croatian - 21,000,000
45. Gan - 20,600,000
46. Awadhi - 20,500,000
47. Thai - 20,000,000
48. Dutch - 20,000,000
49. Yoruba - 20,000,000
50. Sindhi - 19,000,000
(according to Ethnologue)

[Mysko]

English an easy language? Who are you trying to kid now.. Of course the pidgin-English used in international nerd meetings is somewhat easy to grasp, as well as "I go there" -kind of sentences. But, if you once take a look of the scientific texts - or anything on a higher level than the normal three-word-in-a-sentence-composition, you notice that English is not that easy after all...

I know that this is _slightly_ beside the point, but please read the following text and translate it to me, for I am supposed to write an essay about it:

"We need rights, as a distinct element in political theory, only when some decicion injures some people nevertheless finds pirma-facie support in the claim that it will make the community as a whole better off on some plausible account of where the community's general welfare lies. But the most natural source of any objection we might have to such a decision is that, in its concern with ethe welfare or prosperity of or flourishing of people of the whole or in the fulfillment of some interest, widespread within the community, the decision pays insufficient attention to its impact on the minority; and some appeal to equality seems a natural expression of an objection from that source."

In fact I would be grateful if you would find the main verbs of the clauses..

BTW the text is from "Rights as trumps", by Ronald Dworkin.

[Phreakmeister]

Simple: We only need rules when people are hurt. Even if some people say that it may be necessary or good to ignore the rules, even if it is said to be in the common interest. When we ignore rules, we look at the effects of it on the majority, but we tend to ignore the minority. We need rules to protect the minority from the majority, if necessary.

[Sjax]

I know the scientific english too. two of three of the books in my study are written in english.
English is easier than many other languages because there arent so many rules. Example:

German:
Ich spreche
Du sprichst
Er/sie/es spricht
wir sprechen
ihr spreche
Sie/sie sprechen

English:
I talk
You talk
He/she/it talks
we talk
you talk
they talk

The german language also has "kasus" which means that the ending of the word depends on how it is used (nominative, accusative, dativ or genitiv).

Example:
Ich spiele in der Mannschaft (I play on the team).
Die Mannschaft spielt gut (the team plays well)

[Mysko]

So very easy.....

[Madscot]

Actually i think german is not bad for rules. English has no proper rules for past tense. It is probably slightly more common to add
-ed than anthing else but there are so many exeptions.

I jump. I jumped.
I fly i flew.
I sing, I sang.
I eat, i ate.

Also
"He presented the present to the present presentor."