Does it help?

[Sjax]

Do you guys think the war in Afghanistan does any good?
I mean they might remove one terrorist, but they cant stop terrorism.

Personally I just think the war will make more people in the Middle East hate USA, and maybe make more terrorists.

What do you think?

[cleoeo]

Yes, the war does good. We will annihilate the Taliban. They approved Bin Ladin's diabolical plan to attack the US on US soil and they will suffer the consequences. The Taliban may be able to bully the population of Afganistan around, impose their twisted "fundamental" beliefs on a helpless war-ravaged people, but they have grossly overplayed their hand this time. They are toast. Good riddance.
Even Kadhaffi, Khomeni, and Saddam were smart enough to keep their ruthless crap in their own back yards. We let Imperial Japan run wild all over the South Pacific until they were stupid enough to bomb Pearl Harbor. After that their fate was only a matter of time.

[CBranski]

The bombing of Afghanistan is necessary, because frankly we have little choice. The brutal deaths of 5,000+ people must not go unanswered.

Bin Laden and his ilk hate the USA and other free societies because we allow people to chart their own course rather than be a brutal theocracy. And giventhat places like Aghanistan lack opposing media, it's not at all surprising that they have backers.

With this in mind, I do hope this nation and other free nations begin to think long and hard about who they support-after all bin Laden was on the CIA payroll for quite sometime. Taxes taken from citizens should not go to support brutal dictators who do not hold the same values we do. And let's face it-they've proven themselves quite willing to stab us in the back.

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Jennifer Lopez for Mayor

[ogb]

The war is neccessary. It began on Sep 11 and not with the air strike on Afghanistan. Doing nothing would give more power to the terrorists. It is essential for the safety of the whole world to cut the terrorism as much as possible - and you can't solve a problem by simply looking away. Of course the war might hurt on American/European side as well as on Arab side, but there is no choice. The hatred on the USA is taught by the fundamentalists - and this are the ones who have to be fought.

[Phreakmeister]

Unfortunately, it is a necessary evil. Unfortenately there's no other way out.

But remember: it may remove the Taliban, it may remove Al Qaeda, but it won't remove the hatred against the US, which was at the root of all this.

It is a first step in a long process. This may take away a few cells of a terrorist organization, but there are still a lot of dormant cells. This battle hasn't been won yet.

But even after having won this battle, the war isn't over yet. The war is only over, when the US manage to take away the root of the hatred, which is failed foreign policy, and when the liberal forces within islam manage to thrive.

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Do you believe in death after life?

[ogb]

Originally posted by Phreakmeister:

But remember: it may remove the Taliban, it may remove Al Qaeda, but it won't remove the hatred against the US, which was at the root of all this.


I agree and don't agree. Surely we'll have to wait a couple of years what the new government does. As long as troups still control it, I don't see a problem. Just the plain population isn't hating the US in general, that's a misbelief. It takes time to get the propaganda out of their brains, but let them see some progress in their country and you'll also see a change in their attitude. They hate the USA because they are told to. They are kept dumb, they have no own opinion, they hardly know what's going on in the world.

[Phreakmeister]

I wasn't talking about the Afghan people. I was talking about the Arab world. I regret to say it, but there is a sense of genuine hatred against the US. Can't help it.
And that hatred won't be removed by getting rid of Taliban and Al Qaeda. Remember:
How many of the hijackers of September 11th were Afghan? None. Most of them (I think 13 out of the 19) were Saudi citizens.

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Do you believe in death after life?

[ogb]

If the people were free to make up their own mind and free to live as they want to, then I'd wonder if they sticked to their current way of living. Of course the people in the Arab world hate the USA, but just because they are told to and don't have the right to live according their own will.

[Phreakmeister]

Well, not just in the Arab world. Or do you think Genova lies in Arabia? Or Seattle? Or Goteborg? Or Prague? Or Nice?


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Do you believe in death after life?

[ogb]

What do Genoa, Seattle, Prague, Gotenborg and Nice have to do with Afghanistan? This are completely different matters.

I don't agree with most people's opinions on this subject. America is punishing thousands of innocent people (just because someone they are looking for is supposed to be there) for the crimes of a small mob of loose cannons. In my view, this makes them no better than the terrorists they say they are fighting...Besides: War can NEVER be a solution (I know, a little naive)!!!!What's wrong with some serious talking??? Besides that, what the hell is the US ALWAYS doing on other people's turf??? If the US wants to safeguard world peace: Start parenting and stop bullying!!!

Originally posted by ogb:
What do Genoa, Seattle, Prague, Gotenborg and Nice have to do with Afghanistan? This are completely different matters.

No, it's not that different...It's another consequence of of the US bullying around others...

Originally posted by ogb:
If the people were free to make up their own mind and free to live as they want to, then I'd wonder if they sticked to their current way of living. Of course the people in the Arab world hate the USA, but just because they are told to and don't have the right to live according their own will.

You're partly right...In Iran, there is indeed a trend toward a less hatefull attitude toward America...People don't want to stomp the stars and stripes anymore, and are focusing more on their own...However there are parts of the Islamic world where the hatred toward the US isn't imposed on the people: Take, for example, the Palestines, who hate (I know, they overreact) the US because the US is very pro-Israel. In my opinion, the US should either leave the problem to the Israelis and the Palestines or, if they insist on minding other people's business, be neutral.

[Phreakmeister]

Originally posted by ogb:
What do Genoa, Seattle, Prague, Gotenborg and Nice have to do with Afghanistan? This are completely different matters.

This shows that hatred against the US is not just limited to some freaks in the Arab world. Also a lot of very well educated Europeans hate the US sincerely.

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Do you believe in death after life?

[ogb]

Originally posted by Phreakmeister:
This shows that hatred against the US is not just limited to some freaks in the Arab world. Also a lot of very well educated Europeans hate the US sincerely.


Every city you mentioned stands for globalization movement, not the US politics. Afghanistan doesn't fit in this scheme, most of their citizens have never heard of the word "globlization".

You're right, in Germany especially the so called "left-intellectuals" are anti-American, such as literature Nobel-prize winner Günter Grass. Doesn't make their opinions right, lots of terrorists are intellectuals.

[Phreakmeister]

But not all intellectuals are terrorists.

Sure, it's against globalization, but what country was seen as the leader of globalization again?

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Do you believe in death after life?

[ogb]

I didn't say that all intellectuals are terrorists. All I said was that often terrorists are intellectuals.

Globalization is a movement of all industrial nations. How could the USA do globalization alone? This already excludes by the meaning of the word. You're arguing is a bit like "the lady at McDonald's was unfriendly, McDonald's is American and so Americans are unfriendly". If you are looking for blaming someone certain, then you surely got no problems to construct a theory that will support it.

[Phreakmeister]

Originally posted by ogb:
You're arguing is a bit like "the lady at McDonald's was unfriendly, McDonald's is American and so Americans are unfriendly".

I beg your pardon??????????????????????????/
Listen very good, mister know-it-all. I have a lot of friends in the US. I have no problem whatsoever with Americans. Nothing whatsoever. Sure, some Americans are a$$holes, but so are some Germans, and so are some Dutch people.
What I do have a problem with, is both the policy of western governments (free-market-policy), and the policy of the corporations.
That policy includes mistreating animals (like McDonalds is doing), oppressing the workers (like CocaCola is doing in Colombia), letting small children work for next to nothing (almost every single shoe company is doing that). That is what I have been talking about here.

I have said it over and over and over again in every single subject which only slightly concerns the US. I have no problem with Americans. The problems I have with Americans has nothing to do with them being Americans, but with their behaviour. Now start reading and start thinking, before you open your mouth.

And besides that, read what I wrote:

What country is SEEN as the leader of globalization again?


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Do you believe in death after life?

[This message has been edited by Phreakmeister (edited February 17, 2002).]

[TV_Guy]

Ditto: No prob with americans themselves (You bunch are just peachy http://www.dumblaws.com/ubb/biggrin.gif)

[weldordave]

Originally posted by Phreakmeister:

McDonalds-animals Coke-workers shoe companies-children Don't forget diamond mines/workers

[Idnew]

Looks like I'm going to have to install fire hoses to keep the topics that Phreak is in to keep them cool.

Just remember your on an American board here and true Southerners and proud of all our redneck ways. http://www.dumblaws.com/ubb/smile.gif

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(ô¿ô)Proud member of the Dumb Laws Mod Squad so watch it!*smile*

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[TV_Guy]

*Puts on Southern Drawl*

"If we're talking about true southern blood then I'm about as southern as you get."

*tunes guitar*

"Well Iiiiiiiii'm a southern man, I'm southern bred. I've got the south in my blood and I'll be here to I'm **** well dead. Iiiiii'm a southern man........."

[Phreakmeister]

Originally posted by Idnew:
Looks like I'm going to have to install fire hoses to keep the topics that Phreak is in to keep them cool.

Just remember your on an American board here and true Southerners and proud of all our redneck ways. http://www.dumblaws.com/ubb/smile.gif

I know I'm on an American board. But what I've been saying is against policies, and one of the governments carrying out those policies happens to be the US administration. No prob. whatsoever with Americans tho. A lotta great people come from the US (Kurt Cobain, Zack de la Rocha, Eddie Vedder, Jim Morrison, etc. etc. etc.)


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Do you believe in death after life?