BinLaden????

[Hamburglar]

I think that BinLaden is a pretty stupid criminal... Before sept. 11 he was being pretty quite in that cave of his.

Also getting some guys to fly planes into buildings... how stupid is that

[TV_Guy]

Well from his point of view it worked better than he ever could have hoped. I doubt that he is stupid to pull of such a intricate attack. A crafty bugger yes.

[Hamburglar]

So who are you...

Mohamed BinLaden!

LMAO http://www.dumblaws.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

[Idnew]

Actually Hammy he was pretty smart to pull all that off. The stupid ones are the ones that flew the planes and died.

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[Phreakmeister]

Well, you can say a lot about Bin Laden, but he's not dumb. To set up an organization like Al Qaeda, to plan (or have planned) September 11th, that takes a huge amount of intelligence.

[jettmotto]

Originally posted by Idnew:
Actually Hammy he was pretty smart to pull all that off. The stupid ones are the ones that flew the planes and died.



lol my thoughts exactly!

[cleoeo]

He's the stupidest man ever. He thought he was going to bring the World Economy crashing down with the World Trade Center and that his fundamentalist Al Queda network would prosper in the aftermath. Naturally, all he managed to do was infuriate the U.S. enough to finally go after his sorry asp. That spoiled Saudi rich kid was having a blast being the Holy Bigshot of Afganistan. Now we've taken away his playground, run of his bullyboy Taliban friends, and given Afganistan back to the Afganis.

[Enforcer]

I guess smart and mad aren't that far apart...

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Phoenixes RULE!
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[Phreakmeister]

Originally posted by cleoeo:
He's the stupidest man ever. He thought he was going to bring the World Economy crashing down with the World Trade Center

He will. Trust me. The 1930's was nothing compared to what we still got ahead of us.


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Do you believe in death after life?

[Guru]

Smart and intelligent is not the same as wanting good for everyone.

Hitler was a genius and an expert in manipulating people. How else would he have been able to convince a whole nation what he did is ok?

bin Laden is smart for exactly the same reason, he just has some help from the Koran, which makes it easier to talk idiots into flying into buildings or blowing themselves up otherwise.

History is full of similiar cases of geniuses/crackpots, but you get the point.

I remember reading somewhere that most of historys really big madmen had high IQ:s and stuff.
Something just went wrong when they tried tu utilize their smarts which set the big wheel spinning like hell

Think about what these madmen could have done for their nations/humanity if their heads would have stayed screwed on straight?

[sinecure]

Excellent points, Guru.

Think of what Da Vinci, Copernicus, Kepler, Galileo, Newton, and Bill Clinton [:D] could have done to humanity if they had gone to The Dark Side! :eek:

[Ateo]

Originally posted by Guru
Smart and intelligent is not the same as wanting good for everyone.


That's true.

Who are you arguing with?

The people who say that bin Laden is good? Who cares about them anyway? Why are you even acknowledging them?

We all know that Osama is a smart guy, and that he's an assh*le. He ain't no stupid criminal.

Too bad we stopped going after him. Wonder why that was. Was he TOO smart for us? Maybe if he really was a dumb criminal we'd have caught him by now--instead of diverting our attention to Saddam. Problem with that is, once the war starts, he may outsmart us too. He might escape our grasp and go hide in the same cave bin Laden is hiding in. That would be pretty smart.

Doh, those rascally Muslim extremists!

[Guru]

Originally posted by tigsnort


That's true.

Who are you arguing with?

The people who say that bin Laden is good? Who cares about them anyway? Why are you even acknowledging them?


I'm sorry but I missed your point.
Hamburglar and Cleoeo claimed that Osama is stupid. That's what I argued about.
Nobody has claimed that he wants good for anyone. THAT would be stupid. I was just stating that there is not a connection between intelligence and goodness (or evil either for that matter).

[Ateo]

It was the "wanting good for everyone" that threw me...I thought you were insinuating that since some were saying he was a smart guy, that meant they were also saying he was a good guy. Why else would you bring up the "wanting good" part?

I guess I just didn't understand. Whoops.

[Phreakmeister]

Originally posted by Guru
I remember reading somewhere that most of historys really big madmen had high IQ:s and stuff.
Something just went wrong when they tried tu utilize their smarts which set the big wheel spinning like hell

Trivial information:
The highest adult IQ in history belonged to Leonardo da Vinci. He had an IQ of a staggering 220. Will Hunting's (Matt Damon) IQ is estimated to be around 180. According to Guiness Book of Records, the smartest person in the world is Marilyn vos Savant who scored an IQ of 228 as a 10-year old. This would, according to recent research, correspond to an adult IQ of about 185. That score is surpassed by chess player Bobby Fisher (187). The maximum capacity humanly possible is said to have been reached by William James Sidis and Emanuel Swedenborg (Sidis died of brain haemorrhage, Swedenborg turned mad...). Other famous people with high IQ's are/were Goethe (210), Leibniz (205), Newton (195+), John H. Sununu (in the 180's), Netanyahu (also in the 180's), René Descartes (180+), Michelangelo (180+), Kant (175+), Darwin (165+), Einstein (165+), Bill Gates (in the 160's), Stephen Hawking (160+), Benjamin Franklin (160+), Sharon Stone (154), Napoleon Bonaparte (145+), Adolf Hitler (141), Madonna (in the 140's) and Hillary Clinton (also in the 140's) (So Hitler was about as intelligent as Madonna and Hillary Clinton, but not as intelligent as Sharon Stone). Bill Clinton's IQ is said to be 160+ or 170+. According to Professor of History William Leuchtenburg of the University of North Carolina, the four most intelligent US presidents during the 20th century were Woodrow Wilson, Herbert Hoover, Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton. John F. Kennedy's IQ was 117, George W. Bush's IQ is 119, Al Gore's IQ is 134.
According to a recent investigation, most geniuses have been born in March and April. The same investigation states that the fewest geniuses are born in August and September. For more investigation, check the Estimated IQs of the Great Geniuses (http://home8.swipnet.se/~w-80790/Index.htm).

Below is a list of adult IQ's of Geniuses:

Johann Wolfgang von Goethe - 210
Emanuel Swedenborg - 205
Gottfried Wilhelm von Leibniz - 205
John Stuart Mill - 200
Blaise Pascal - 195
Ludwig Wittgenstein - 190
Bobby Fischer - 187
Galileo Galilei - 185
René Descartes - 180
Madame De Stael - 180
Immanuel Kant - 175
Linus Carl Pauling - 170
Sofia Kovalevskaya - 170
Thomas Chatterton - 170
Charles Darwin - 165
Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart - 165
George Eliot - 160
Nicolaus Copernicus - 160
Rembrandt van Rijn - 155
George Sand - 150

[AWPrime]

You need to be really smart to know the IQ's of people who died before the invention of reliable IQ tests.

[w1che]

Well I can see why some posting on this thread would think Ben is really smart.. Unless you got a lot of info the rest of the world doesn't have..
How do you know 9/11 was Ben's idea?..

How do you know he did any of the planning?

How do you know that Atta or someone else didn't call Ben & say.. "Hey Ben, I have this great idea. We get a bunch of guys & grab some planes loaded with fuel fly them into the World Trade center. All I need from you is the money & Ok.. I'll take care of all the details." How do you know that didn't happen?

By the way it doesn't take a lot of brains to have people hide you like the coward he is.. :rolleyes:

[AWPrime]

If Bin Laden did not hide, I would have called him a bloody idiot.

Like: Here I am, drop some bombs on me please?

[w1che]

Quote.. If Bin Laden did not hide, I would have called him a bloody idiot.
>>>>>

More in-depth thinking from AWPrime..

As Tig keeps pointing out he isn't found yet..Like Bush wouldn't give his right nut to find old Ben today.. The only way to find him now is for someone to Rat him out or he screws up big time.. That day will come if he doesn't die first..
:rolleyes:

[AWPrime]

Would Bush be able to continou the 'war on terror' if Bin Laden is caught?

[w1che]

Why Not? Do you think the rest of the terrorist are just going to give up & start living the good life when Ben is gone for good.. Not likely...

Now I do believe that Bush would like for him to die real quite like so he doesn't become a martyr so I think (Don't Know) that when he is found he will have been dead for some time.. :cool

[Mary]

W1che you asked for this.
Isn´t Ben reason war against terror started? What if we have confirmed information abaut his death? Isn´t he one leader for al´qaida. Do you really think that, if bin ladens is dead, US would carrie on with this war?

[kontulib]

Well, war against terrorism will never end. So long when USA have enemies, there will be some group who want to destroy that country, and on the world will be such groups rest of the eternity. So, USA can continue "war against terrorism" rest of the eternity and fight with real terrorists and not-real terrorist rest of the eternity. Well, in that case, eternity will not be a long time :rolleyes:

[w1che]

Quote Mary... Isn´t Ben reason war against terror started?
>>>>
Your right about one thing Mary. Old Ben's group did do the 9/11 deed but it's my feeling the terrorist will not lay over & play dead if he is killed. I hope they would see the error of their ways but feel that is very wishful thinking.. There are many terrorist groups that are only loosely tied to Ben's group.. Would they shut down with Ben's demise? My feeling is they won't??

Yeah I know Kon.. America is trying to take over the world. Just because there are groups around blowing people when ever they can has nothing to do with it.. Right?

The story is if you hit America enough then you pay a price.. You may not know 9/11 was not the first time Americans had been killed by that group. Then again you may know but feel we shouldn't protect ourselves??

You can believe that with or with out you Finnie's we will do what we have to do... :cool

[Mary]

W1che I do agree with you that terrorism has not ever lead to anything.(somebody should send those guys a history book) And yes I know some attacs before 9/11. But would US really continue this war if Ben was dead? I somehow don´t think so.

[kontulib]

Originally posted by w1che

Yeah I know Kon.. America is trying to take over the world. Just because there are groups around blowing people when ever they can has nothing to do with it.. Right?

The story is if you hit America enough then you pay a price.. You may not know 9/11 was not the first time Americans had been killed by that group. Then again you may know but feel we shouldn't protect ourselves??

You can believe that with or with out you Finnie's we will do what we have to do... :cool

Of course groups who are blowing people have something to do with it...but I am wondering why America is the target so often...Of course, America have did nothing wrong. Right?
America is just a innocent victim. Right? Groups who are attacking against America, they are only the bad guys and America have never did anything wrong against them. Right?

Pay a price...Ok, same to USA. If USA hits against some country/group, then USA pay the price. Isn´t that fair. Why in hell "others" must to pay the price when they are attacking against USA and USA must never pay anything.
Yes, I know at you guys have much of power, guns, missiles, nukes but that doesn´t make you better people...

Of course you have right to protect yourselves. PROTECT THEN! DON´T MONGER WAR ALL THE TIME!

I belive at you do what you need to do...and much things what you don´t need to do.

[kontulib]

I am not trying to defence terrorism or anything like that. I´m only trying to get something sense for that ridicilous thing named "war against terrorism".

[w1che]

quote kon... I belive at you do what you need to do...and much things what you don´t need to do.
.>>>>
Of course you have a right to believe anything you like.. Even when your dead wrong...

If you will look up where the terrorist have hit you will find it's not only Americans.. but i think you know that already??

if you can't understand the concept of hitting them before they hit us to keep them off balance then i don't know what to tell you..:cool

[Mary]

W1hce I have little queston for you. I really don´t know.What has US done abaut abu sayaf? Aren´t they terroist group? Don´t war against terror mean all terrorist group?:confused:
On topic: yes Bin Laden is smart.How else he could organize group like Al qaida or 9/11 attacs?

[kontulib]

Originally posted by Mary
Aren´t they terroist group? Don´t war against terror mean all terrorist group?:confused:

Term "Terrorist group" is not a exact thing. Some group who are non-terrorists today can be terrorists tomorrow.
Some governments thinks at PKK is terrorist group, some governments don´t think so.

[Mary]

I know term "terrorist group" isn´t exact. But if you are asking somebody queston, shouldn´t you use language which he or she understand?

[w1che]

Mary in answer to your question...

Philippine military fighting major battle against Abu Sayyaf
Philippine President Gloria Arroyo says the military is fighting a major battle against the Abu Sayyaf rebel group, linked by Washington to the al-Qaida terrorist network.
In a Manila speech Friday, \Arroyo said troops overran four Abu Sayyaf camps in southern Sulu province, and are now going after the group's top two leaders.
Military officials are still waiting to learn casualty figures for the raids. The operation comes one day after the guerrillas killed one Philippine officer and wounded six other soldiers.
Last week, Philippine troops killed three Abu Sayyaf rebels including one of the group's leaders, Abu Sabaya. Philippine pursuit of the Abu Sayyaf has increased since some of the rebels were cornered in a battle early this month. That battle left two hostages the group had been holding dead, one an American missionary and the other a Philippine nurse. The Abu Sayyaf is believed to have been reduced from about 1,000 fighters to fewer than 250 over the past year. The group says it is fighting for a Muslim state in the southern Philippines, but has become best known as a kidnapping-for-ransom group. About 1,000 U.S. troops are in the southern Philippines to train Philippine soldiers fighting the Abu Sayyaf. While the Americans have provided technical assistance, they are barred from taking part in actual combat.
>>>>>
Barred by the Philippines I may add...Does that answer your Question?


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[Mary]

Thank you w1che that answered more questions than you think. Now I have only one, but I don´t think you could anwer that. (nothing personal you just aren´t fin)

[sinecure]

Originally posted by Mary
W1hce I have little queston for you. I really don´t know.What has US done abaut abu sayaf? Aren´t they terroist group? Don´t war against terror mean all terrorist group?:confused:


This is like the driver who gets pulled over for speeding and then directs the officer's attention to all the other cars that are whizzing by and asks why he doesn't stop them... implying that to stop him for speeding when many others are breaking the law by speeding too... well the officer is somehow being unfair.

The answer is that sometimes you can only catch one fish at a time, and today just happened to be your day.

Likewise with terrorists. There are many various terrorist organizations all over the world these days. It just happened that by crashing our airliners into the WTC and killing thousands of non-combatant people, well, Bin's group really caught our attention this time.

[Mary]

Sinecure, I just wanted to know about abu sayaf. They kidnap two finnish man (and many others) couple of years ago. So they got my attension.